Submitted to a Candid World


Hagee Meets the Senator: Joe Lieberman Doesn’t Know When He’s Being Used
July 23, 2008, 12:00 pm
Filed under: Author - ACG, Politics, Science | Tags: , , ,

Heyyyyyy brother...

Joe Lieberman seems to be missing the point.

Again.

Praising Reverend John Hagee yesterday for allegedly combating antisemitism, Senator Lieberman seemed to confuse Hagee’s belief that Jews are useful tools for bringing about the Rapture, with genuine affection for God’s chosen people.

Make no mistake, Hagee views the Jews not as friends, but as little more than infantry pieces in an ecclesiastical game of Risk. This is the man, after all, who thinks that Hitler did God’s work by getting the Jews to Israel, and the same fellow who opposes peace in Israel, because war must come before the Rapture. Hagee epitomizes the belief that man ought to visit suffering and death upon his fellow man, scour the Earth, and otherwise do whatever necessary to check the boxes leading inexorably to the Rapture.

Assuming for the sake of argument that this myth of recent invention, “the Rapture,” is real, it’s not a damn World of Warcraft quest – you can’t cut corners and mechanically check boxes to bring about divine salvation. One would think that a just and loving God would frown upon fomenting war just to gain His favors a little sooner. The shocking reduction of all points of belief to mechanical chores, and the sheer vanity of imagining that God’s will can be known so plainly and manipulated so readily, is simply astonishing. What a hollow and uniquely un-godly faith Hagee-style fundamentalists practice.

How Lieberman can miss the fact that Hagee wants only to climb over the Jews’ backs just to get to the heavenly cookie jar of imaginary salvation is beyond me. Hagee views the Jews as the carpenter views a drill: instruments to be used, not friends to be respected or treated as equals. Hagee is an embarassment to the human race, and a danger to Jews.

Although, the sheer plainness of Hagee’s evil makes me sure that Lieberman must be aware of it… which makes this a political stunt, and a particularly degrading one at that, for Lieberman. But if it’s a political stunt… what’s it a stunt for?


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John Hagee was the name I selected to put on my fake ID.

Ah those were the days….

Comment by Tmtoulouse

McCain looks strikingly like a ventriloquist’s dummy in that picture. Take that how you will.

Comment by Gotchaye

I had a dream that I was a World of Warcraft character… I had to kill all of these evil humanoid badger dudes, and I could see the green life bars above their heads (which would get shorter as I beat them up).

This has nothing to do with Hagee (whom I’ve never heard of) or Lieberman, but they’re probably right about the Jews. Let’s think about this: the Jews have seen 3,000+ years of getting hated and dominated and isolated and enslaved and beat up; why would God let that change now!? No, my friend, it is obvious that they are the stairs upon which the righteous will step as the Second Coming nears. *

Nice work, Ames! I’ll be in touch.

* This post was 100% tongue-in-cheek and tasteless.

Comment by Bad Andy

“One would think that a just and loving God would frown upon fomenting war just to gain His favors a little sooner.”

I agree with just about everything you say, except this. Accepting for the moment that God exists (and I’m horribly torn on the point, more on that as the occasion calls for), I really do buy the argument that humans not understanding why He does something means it can’t make sense. I realize that argument is often seen as a cop-out by atheists, and I see why it’s a frustrating answer, but I don’t think that makes it wrong. If I can’t possibly see all the inputs to a situation that God can, or understand them all in connection to one another, why should the outputs make sense?

The reason this doesn’t excuse Hagee, of course, if that there’s no reason to think HE has it right just because he happens to believe in God in a particular way. “God is incomprehensible” is a borderline-retarded defense for doing something in God’s name.

~ John

Comment by John

Seriously though, while I can agree that Hagee is bonkers, it’s easy to understand why an American Jew might feel that his way of thinking is something to encourage. There are creepy means-to-an-end undertones to it all, but the fact remains that Hagee’s ilk don’t actually endorse the Holocaust or seek to recreate it – while their particular obsession with Israel is due to Revelation, they also draw pretty strongly on Genesis, and they see recent history as evidence that God’s early promise to Abraham (that He will bless those who bless him and curse those who curse him) is still being enforced. They point to Russia, Germany, and Poland as examples of anti-semitic countries which have gotten pretty badly bloodied in the 20th century (and, more recently, they sometimes try to argue that the Arab world is in poor shape precisely because of its general dislike of Jews). I’ve even seen them use the US’ relative friendliness to Jews to explain why the US has done so well for itself, etc.

And it’s certainly the case that conservative Christians are much friendlier to Jews now than they were a century ago, thanks in no small part to this focus on protecting the Jews until God can kill them off. Whether or not this sort of thing has helped diminish anti-semitism of thought, it’s certainly reduced anti-semitism of action. As long as the Tribulation isn’t actually imminent, I for one don’t have much of an objection to patting useful idiots on the back if that encourages people like Hagee in taking actions that are better for Jews than they otherwise would be.

But I admit that it’s very hard for a Jew to be rational about this sort of thing. I try not to trust my first instinct on anything touching on Jews or Israel, both because it’s bound to be touched by cultural boosterism but also because attitudes and lessons derived from the diaspora and the Holocaust are impressed on most of us from a very young age, and I, for one, find it very hard to think critically about them.

I regret never talking to Andrea about this sort of thing. I’m sure she’d have a very interesting take.

Comment by Gotchaye

Nevermind. I’d been thinking that Hagee was a run of the mill Rapturer. For whatever reason, I hadn’t heard about his recent comments. When your ‘yesterday’ link went to a page with the same post at the top of it, I assumed it was broken, so I was going in mostly blind. Calling the Holocaust part of “God’s plan” is forgivable, just as you say the same about a death, but yes, it’s obviously deranged to actively try to keep Israel from peace, and no one should support or endorse that.

Comment by Gotchaye

Ugh. I’ve been googling this and reading up on it – why have I not heard about any of this until now? Wright was all over the internet for weeks, and Hagee’s at least that bad. Lieberman should be ashamed.

Comment by Gotchaye

I’m sorry for chain-posting on this, but I am absolutely disgusted at Hagee and McCain and at myself for posting that defense earlier. And National Review has had the utter gall to go on at length about how we don’t really know whether or not Obama would be a friend to Israel.

Comment by Gotchaye

Gotchaye, on the “why wright but not hager” point – RIGHT ON. And no worries for defending him at first – just glad to be getting the word out about Hagee’s evil. Isn’t he awful? Ugh.

And Andy – one of the best comments ever!

Comment by Ames

[...] Continuing her appeal to the lowest common demoninator, Sarah Palin persisted in claiming that Obama favored court-instituted socialism, per a 2001 quote that actually says the exact opposite. Meanwhile, Republicans are using Obama’s association with a pro-Palestine U.Chicago professor to insinuate that Barack Obama is anti-Semitic, a cancerous lie drawing strength from the various chain e-mails that continue to paraodoxically insist that – in one breath – Barack Obama is a Muslim with a controversial Christian pastor. But if you want to talk about anti-Semitism… let’s talk about John McCain and John Hagee. [...]

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